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[4/28/12] Inferno Installment Four - What lies beyond the void?


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#121 Axel Ryman

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 10:02 PM

He might have been the Sorting Hat, once upon a dream. The Contagion was made fully from scratch, but when I finished him I got a distinct Kane and Krodos vibe from him. Probably from the color choices.



Guess Hogwarts had a zombie invasion.

THAT'S WHERE I RECOGNIZED HIM!! Wow I can't believe I forgot their names.
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#122 Secret Igshar

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 10:03 PM

Kang* oops. But yeah. I realized it and then said oh well I love him. He is just slimy enough to be perfect. He's like a giant ball of snot with eyes. Kind of gross...

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#123 Axel Ryman

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 10:04 PM

I demand a tissue as a weapon now, just to fight that thing.
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#124 Xanius

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 11:31 PM

the one looks really freaking odd. I love the Zombie flan, he's pretty cool. Im all for more sprites with animation myself honestly. So its neat that he's in there. Maybe the special guys of each area can be animated. That would be pretty neat. Things like Behemoths or Marlboros. That would be pretty niffty. l

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#125 Secret Igshar

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 11:36 PM

I'll consider doing more animations, but I wouldn't bet on seeing many (if any at all) since most of the sprites I would want to animate are FAR too complicated for it to be worth the effort to actually animate them. Example: Guard Scorpion.

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#126 Xanius

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 11:38 PM

Even something as simple as an Evil Eye blinking would be fun and awesome Ig. Just throwing that out there.

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#127 Secret Igshar

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 06:25 AM

The first post has been updated with what I imagine will be a FINALIZED release date. Considering that story % of 91 means that there is literally one more area to code up (and the coding for it is already quite far along), I expect to be finished coding storyline TOMORROW. Which gives me a good two weeks to get all of the secrets in and tested.

Taking our time with release for a few reasons, not least of which being you guys want the secrets and, as such, I need to make them... and I have finals coming up, so I won't be able to devote NEARLY as much time to working on this as I usually do. I am quite certain I'll manage what needs to be done in time! So look forward to May 4th!


Release time will likely be somewhere around noonish EST, but it COULD be pushed to later in the afternoon, depending on Val's and Shino's availability that day (since I have an hour of transit time I'll need to account for, I think, and I want one of us online for the time immediately following release.)


Stay tuned for more information as the release gets closer.

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#128 Axel Ryman

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:33 PM

So Iggy and myself have been barking about on something for everyone, and thanks to our 100% efforts(1% my idea, 99% his genius), we have a way for some spells to be cast so it is fair for both STR and MAG users without being OP for one and UP for the other. What we(And by we I mean he) made is % spells, so now the spell cost is fairer for both types of players.



This won't apply to all spells of course, just ones both players can benefit from....or well...whatever spells Iggy decides of course. :058:
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#129 Secret Igshar

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:47 PM

As Axie said, % MP cost spells~ :D

What is most novel about this is that it tears down literally the ONLY thing that had been keeping me from incorporating a Haste spell into the player's arsenal. That was the MP cost. :I

It would have been like 15 MP or so, but that's a shitton for physical players and garbage for mages. With this in place, I can now make it cost 50% of your total MP, meaning that physical players (25 MP) would spend ~13 to cast it (which is a lot) while mages (75 MP) would spend ~38 to cast it (which is also a lot). :D Makes it nice and balanced.

Still need to play with it a little before it's definitely added to Chapter 4, but the latest you'll see it (if at all) would be the weekend following release.

Edited by Rumbleroar, 22 April 2012 - 04:55 PM.

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#130 Secret Felix

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:59 PM

/me promptly whines about it
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#131 Dexel Hydagara

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 05:03 PM

/me promptly says "meh"

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#132 Secret Igshar

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 05:13 PM

To try and stir discussion, let me bring Artemis' complaints to the thread instead of (nonsensically) keeping them private.

He wants to see ceilings and floors for % MP spells so that Haste, for example, would not go below some number like 15 or 20 while it would not rise above 50 or so, because if you have 120 MP, then 60 is too much to spend on one spell.


My arguments to this go as follows.

1. If you are running 120 MP, you would likely not want to be running your % MP spells when your best MP healing spell gets you a net +60.

2. Since your best MP healing spell gives a net +60, running 120 MP and expecting your life to be EXCELLENT is ignorant anyway, so I am not inclined to care about any complaints of % MP spells costing too much for them.

3. He argued that Haste should cost more than one Manastep can heal, since he somehow thinks that would be fair...? My argument is that one Manastep (which is arguably the only MP restoration skill any self-respecting physical attacker ever brings into battle) would heal you for +2 net after casting Haste, which is a 13% return on the total MP Manastep can get you. As a mage (in my 75 MP example) a single Aspira would get you back a net +22, which is a 37% return on the total MP Aspira can net you. Seems pretty balanced to me. But maybe I'm just silly?


Please debate these points (or agree with them) freely, here. :D This is an open discussion of a brand new mechanic which has NOT been finalized yet. Your issues and complaints will be seriously considered, if they are valid.

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#133 Valor

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 09:58 PM

If we get haste, I want to be able to use it as a physical attacker without forcing points into my MP. Mages aren't forced to bring Dex in order to cast spells that they like, so why should it be any different? Mages are able to heal asstons more MP more quickly and more efficiently than physical attackers can. The trade off is that physical attackers can deal damage AND restore their HP and MP slightly.

It's a balanced system. 60 MP is a lot of MP for a spell, but at the same time if you're running 120 MP you can probably heal 75+% of that back with a single spell (I dunno why it would be necessary to run that much otherwise). We're already making sure the % MP spells start low and get to where they'll stay when they're mastered so they're easier to train.

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#134 Secret Felix

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 10:40 PM

My arguments to this go as follows.

1. If you are running 120 MP, you would likely not want to be running your % MP spells when your best MP healing spell gets you a net +60.


I would use increased mp in situations in which I know I might need to heal many times in a row. Restoring 120 mp is two casts of aspilra, and yields the best restore to spell ration, after 75. Not carrying or casting a spell because you have too much mp is a silly argument. You would never tell a warrior to not use an sleight because he has too much dex.

2. Since your best MP healing spell gives a net +60, running 120 MP and expecting your life to be EXCELLENT is ignorant anyway, so I am not inclined to care about any complaints of % MP spells costing too much for them.


120 mp won't be that much once you factor in % mp equipment and new equips.

3. He argued that Haste should cost more than one Manastep can heal, since he somehow thinks that would be fair...? My argument is that one Manastep (which is arguably the only MP restoration skill any self-respecting physical attacker ever brings into battle) would heal you for +2 net after casting Haste, which is a 13% return on the total MP Manastep can get you. As a mage (in my 75 MP example) a single Aspira would get you back a net +22, which is a 37% return on the total MP Aspira can net you. Seems pretty balanced to me. But maybe I'm just silly?



Okay, so you're a mage and you're running 75 mp. Cool. I hate using anything over base mp, too. Water is so useless. But I regress. Since we're assuming you're a good mage and aspira costs 15 mp, let's go ahead and say you keep at least 15 mp in reserve at all times. Therefore, your pool of mp is actually only 60. Now it's time to haste. This spell uses a whopping 38 mp. You now have 22 mp left before you absolutely have to aspira. That's two attacks baring you don't have to heal. That's kind of lame.

If we get haste, I want to be able to use it as a physical attacker without forcing points into my MP. Mages aren't forced to bring Dex in order to cast spells that they like, so why should it be any different? Mages are able to heal asstons more MP more quickly and more efficiently than physical attackers can. The trade off is that physical attackers can deal damage AND restore their HP and MP slightly.

It's a balanced system. 60 MP is a lot of MP for a spell, but at the same time if you're running 120 MP you can probably heal 75+% of that back with a single spell (I dunno why it would be necessary to run that much otherwise). We're already making sure the % MP spells start low and get to where they'll stay when they're mastered so they're easier to train.


I don't really think that's a fair argument. You're basically saying because mages have to carry more and warriors don't need to carry more, the increased cost is justified. Well then I'll argue there should also be a % dex debuff. This evens things up and makes a warrior less likely to spam haste. This would still hinder a mage, as they would have trouble casting enchants. If you want it justified with canon, it's like you're hyped up on caffeine are really twitchy; or not as dexterous. It wouldn't necessarily be a 50% cut, but this would allow the mp % cut to be lowered to a more reasonable level.

EDIT: Also Aspira is a 50% heal at 120 mp, not 75%+.
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#135 Secret Igshar

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 10:56 PM

I would use increased mp in situations in which I know I might need to heal many times in a row. Restoring 120 mp is two casts of aspilra, and yields the best restore to spell ration, after 75. Not carrying or casting a spell because you have too much mp is a silly argument. You would never tell a warrior to not use an sleight because he has too much dex.

Then don't use Haste with 120 MP and Aspira backup.

120 mp won't be that much once you factor in % mp equipment and new equips.

Yes it will, since every set I ran when testing Chapter 3 had no more than 77 MP. This is taking into account new equipments. People bitched about high MP on equips, so I have been lowering it. :>

Okay, so you're a mage and you're running 75 mp. Cool. I hate using anything over base mp, too. Water is so useless. But I regress. Since we're assuming you're a good mage and aspira costs 15 mp, let's go ahead and say you keep at least 15 mp in reserve at all times. Therefore, your pool of mp is actually only 60. Now it's time to haste. This spell uses a whopping 38 mp. You now have 22 mp left before you absolutely have to aspira. That's two attacks baring you don't have to heal. That's kind of lame.

Let's also take into account what Haste is going to do for you for that 38 MP spent. It will give either you or your Spirit an extra turn for the next good long while. As of current, the spell lasts 20 turns. Quite a nice amount of time. I may increase that turn count before giving the spell to stores, since (as I have said) we haven't done testing with it yet. If anything, I think the turns or amount boosted would be the main (if not only) issues. I do not foresee the MP aspect being much of a problem at all, especially when you take into account the fact that throwing up the spell gifts you a second turn. If it is not gifting you with a second turn, you're probably using it wrong. Fighting with two turns gives everyone MORE than enough time to do whatever the balls they want to.

I don't really think that's a fair argument. You're basically saying because mages have to carry more and warriors don't need to carry more, the increased cost is justified. Well then I'll argue there should also be a % dex debuff. This evens things up and makes a warrior less likely to spam haste. This would still hinder a mage, as they would have trouble casting enchants. If you want it justified with canon, it's like you're hyped up on caffeine are really twitchy; or not as dexterous. It wouldn't necessarily be a 50% cut, but this would allow the mp % cut to be lowered to a more reasonable level.

That's not even remotely fair. Mages have access to 75 dex techs to cast their spells. Those are called 100%, sure-hit techs to ensure the activation of the Augment attached to your weapon. Losing 3 out of your 5 dex would not hinder you in any way of connected. Even with a 50% dex cut (which would be outrageously drastic to a physical attacker) if I then extended it to work for all techs activated as well, your dex would still be 40. That's enough to hit 100% on 25 eva. Let me be the first to tell you that, out of the 80-ish? monsters in Chapter 4, exactly 0 of them have 25 eva or greater.

While the general idea of losing dex to boost speed sounds like a brilliant one, realize that a mage can restore his/her MP back to full. A physical attacker CANNOT restore his/her dex back to full for the duration of the haste spell. It is in no way MORE balanced by cutting the player's dex.

EDIT: Also Aspira is a 50% heal at 120 mp, not 75%+.

I don't think that was even said. The argument was that, if 120 MP were an intelligent amount of MP to ever be running, you would be able to heal back 75%+ of it with a single spell. Since you know 60 is 75%+ of 75.



That all being said, I may cut down the 50% to something more like a 30-35% instead, but we'll have to see. Regardless it will be a % MP spell, because no matter what number I slap onto it (be it 15 or 25) it will be an exorbitant amount for a physical attacker compared with being a trivial drop in the bucket for the mage.


And if you're this upset about 50% mp spells, I can't wait to see your reaction to the 60 and 75% spells.

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#136 Valor

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 11:39 PM

I was implying that by the time you actually are running 120 MP (since it ain't in chapter 4 as far as I've seen) you're gonna have aspi...ga.. ew. Ugly name. Anyway

Cutting Dex to boost Speed is really stupid and not a fair trade off at all.

Cutting 13 MP off of my 25 with a single spell is equivalent to you using up 38 MP with a single cast of Haste. We can both heal it back with a single action, but you have to be really to use it so you don't screw yourself into a corner.

To counter what you said about your two attacks until you must aspira, you can caste chakra only twice at 12 MP before you're totally out of MP, and then it takes 2 (3?) Manafonts before you're back to full MP. As an attacker, I'm likely casting haste on myself and using us a good chunk of those turns (thinking about the turn rotation) healing my MP back to full before I start attacking in earnest because I'll need the MP in case I get in trouble. As an attacker you don't have to ever find yourself low in HP and low in MP. That's called a loss.

13 MP out of 25 is very significant, and even higher is more significant in changing up a battle's flow if I wanted to use haste. Mages can use it much more easily and effectively, as you've demonstrated already. I think it's pretty fair.

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#137 Xanius

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 11:45 PM

I personally like this idea and I find it pretty fair. I can understand certain complaints with it. It does seem to hurt a mage moer then it does a str user. But MP is a very important part of a Str users arsenal. He needs MP to stay alive, cutting his by half can put him in a pickle. Only has 12 mp left while a Mage has a fair bit more then that. Mage can heal for more as well so they arent at a risk like a str user is but they do heave healing techs so... *shrugs* Can't wait to see what other idea you have planned for % based spells.

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#138 Secret Felix

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 04:10 AM

So many quotes. x-x

Then don't use Haste with 120 MP and Aspira backup.


You just don't understand efficiency. If you have overflow when casting an mp recovery spill, you're doing it wrong.

So many wasted mpees! Shame on you, leaving them on the ground for anyone to pick up!

Yes it will, since every set I ran when testing Chapter 3 had no more than 77 MP. This is taking into account new equipments. People bitched about high MP on equips, so I have been lowering it. :>


If nothing else, at least I've gotten through to you on this front.

Let's also take into account what Haste is going to do for you for that 38 MP spent. It will give either you or your Spirit an extra turn for the next good long while. As of current, the spell lasts 20 turns. Quite a nice amount of time. I may increase that turn count before giving the spell to stores, since (as I have said) we haven't done testing with it yet. If anything, I think the turns or amount boosted would be the main (if not only) issues. I do not foresee the MP aspect being much of a problem at all, especially when you take into account the fact that throwing up the spell gifts you a second turn. If it is not gifting you with a second turn, you're probably using it wrong. Fighting with two turns gives everyone MORE than enough time to do whatever the balls they want to.


If I'm running a haste build with 120 mp, it will likely be my spirit that gets the extra turn, not me. So I don't consider the, "you have more turns to restore mp," argument very valid, unless spirits get some nifty spells that benefit the team.

Also, you act like 20 turns is an eternity, but that really depends on how many monsters you're doubling, no? It would be nicer if you could find some way to quantify turns into rounds, but that's not the point. If you cast haste on an ally, the time you have to restore your mp before you must recast it is quite variable.

That's not even remotely fair. Mages have access to 75 dex techs to cast their spells. Those are called 100%, sure-hit techs to ensure the activation of the Augment attached to your weapon. Losing 3 out of your 5 dex would not hinder you in any way of connected. Even with a 50% dex cut (which would be outrageously drastic to a physical attacker) if I then extended it to work for all techs activated as well, your dex would still be 40. That's enough to hit 100% on 25 eva. Let me be the first to tell you that, out of the 80-ish? monsters in Chapter 4, exactly 0 of them have 25 eva or greater.

While the general idea of losing dex to boost speed sounds like a brilliant one, realize that a mage can restore his/her MP back to full. A physical attacker CANNOT restore his/her dex back to full for the duration of the haste spell. It is in no way MORE balanced by cutting the player's dex.


Lols, nice way to completely miss the point. Yes, a mage can hit anything with their dex tech. Hitting something and casting an enchant on it is not quite the same thing, though. I'm not quite sure why you completely ignored the fact that the mage just lost 50% of their total mp. Let's hope they had at least 53 mp. See how that works? The loss of dex for a mage or the loss of mp for a warrior is meant to be a minor hindrance, not the primary one.

Again, you (and Val) seem to have extrapolated my suggestion to a ridiculous extreme. I realize 50% is a giant dex cut. Thanks for explaining that. Derp.

A 15% or even 20% dex cut, however, is not.

If you run 30 dex (which sounds like a shipton), that's a loss of five to six dex for double turns. Such a bad trade. If only there was some way to gain dex every time you atta- Oh wait. Techniques.

For the sake of the arguement, let's go with the 15% debuff. Primary -ra's are +4. Depending on when the debuff is applied, we have two possibilities. 15% of 30 is 4.5. Rounding up, that gives us 5. You're now at 25 base. The tech now takes effect boosting the player's dex to 29. Exchanging one dex for double turns. Yea, that is so unbalanced. The debuff % might need to be bumped up. As for the other possibility, 30+4 is 34. 15% of 34 is 5.1. Assuming you round down, we're back at 29, again. Need even more dex to go with your double turns? Try a Mockingjay enchanted with dodge break and use target.

So if you want to argue that one dex is an omfgamechanger, be my guest. The point of all of this was that show that there is a happy median between the two. You just need to find it, and I will continue to argue until you do so.

I don't think that was even said. The argument was that, if 120 MP were an intelligent amount of MP to ever be running, you would be able to heal back 75%+ of it with a single spell. Since you know 60 is 75%+ of 75.


I just assumed Val was really bad at math?

This one took too much reading between the lines for me to get. My bad.

And if you're this upset about 50% mp spells, I can't wait to see your reaction to the 60 and 75% spells.


Time to go str and/or base mp. Stupid mp floors, amirite?

Cutting Dex to boost Speed is really stupid and not a fair trade off at all.


Spoken like a true strength user. Lols.

Cutting 13 MP off of my 25 with a single spell is equivalent to you using up 38 MP with a single cast of Haste. We can both heal it back with a single action, but you have to be really to use it so you don't screw yourself into a corner.

To counter what you said about your two attacks until you must aspira, you can caste chakra only twice at 12 MP before you're totally out of MP, and then it takes 2 (3?) Manafonts before you're back to full MP. As an attacker, I'm likely casting haste on myself and using us a good chunk of those turns (thinking about the turn rotation) healing my MP back to full before I start attacking in earnest because I'll need the MP in case I get in trouble. As an attacker you don't have to ever find yourself low in HP and low in MP. That's called a loss.

13 MP out of 25 is very significant, and even higher is more significant in changing up a battle's flow if I wanted to use haste. Mages can use it much more easily and effectively, as you've demonstrated already. I think it's pretty fair.


Most of your concerns are adressed in my replies to Iggy, but he's my two cents, just for you.

You seem to have an mp problem. Have you tried applying more than base mp? No? Okay, well, first try that.

Still having a problem? Consider one of the two following suggestions if your chapter two mp recovery tech just isn't cutting it when you're trying to cast haste, enchants, and healing spells:

1) Add three mag and cast one aspil. 20 net mp get!

2) Add zero mag and cast one aspira. 30 net mp get!

But joking aside, I never said that the mp loss is insignificant for a warrior. A 50% loss is too major for either class. That's why it needs to be lowered and balanced with a dex debuff. Possibly 25% for both. Or some other random number. I'm not the number guy.

Edited by Artemis, 23 April 2012 - 04:19 AM.

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#139 Secret Igshar

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 07:23 AM

If I'm running a haste build with 120 mp, it will likely be my spirit that gets the extra turn, not me. So I don't consider the, "you have more turns to restore mp," argument very valid, unless spirits get some nifty spells that benefit the team.

You mean like MP Gift?

Also, you act like 20 turns is an eternity, but that really depends on how many monsters you're doubling, no? It would be nicer if you could find some way to quantify turns into rounds, but that's not the point. If you cast haste on an ally, the time you have to restore your mp before you must recast it is quite variable.


I didn't say 20 turns was long, I just said it seemed long enough. Again, has not been tested, and the turn number will likely be increasing before it's done (along with the speed buff from 3 to 5, but I'll explain why that is later).


Lols, nice way to completely miss the point. Yes, a mage can hit anything with their dex tech. Hitting something and casting an enchant on it is not quite the same thing, though. I'm not quite sure why you completely ignored the fact that the mage just lost 50% of their total mp. Let's hope they had at least 53 mp. See how that works? The loss of dex for a mage or the loss of mp for a warrior is meant to be a minor hindrance, not the primary one.

I can see this. You're the one who mentioned how the dex cut would somehow affect the mage, though.

A 15% or even 20% dex cut, however, is not.

This will be fun.

If you run 30 dex (which sounds like a shipton), that's a loss of five to six dex for double turns. Such a bad trade. If only there was some way to gain dex every time you atta- Oh wait. Techniques.

For the sake of comparison, 30 dex is 150 mp. Not even you talked about using that much. Any halfway decent physical attacker does not use more dex than absolutely necessary for any given battle. They take their techs into account when devising stats so that their base dex + 4 or 1 from blizzara or aquara strike will even out to give a 10% or less miss chance on the opponent (possibly after eva debuff/dex buff if that's the battle plan).

For the sake of the arguement, let's go with the 15% debuff. Primary -ra's are +4. Depending on when the debuff is applied, we have two possibilities. 15% of 30 is 4.5. Rounding up, that gives us 5. You're now at 25 base. The tech now takes effect boosting the player's dex to 29. Exchanging one dex for double turns. Yea, that is so unbalanced. The debuff % might need to be bumped up. As for the other possibility, 30+4 is 34. 15% of 34 is 5.1. Assuming you round down, we're back at 29, again. Need even more dex to go with your double turns? Try a Mockingjay enchanted with dodge break and use target.

It is 5 dex, not 1. 5 dex IS a game changer. A debuff of 3 from enemies casting Seal is enough to make any physical attacker cringe and cross their fingers. MISSING with an attack is something mages do not worry about. Ever. Unless they are willingly casting the spells with a miss chance built in. In that case, they know the risk and are employing it with fixed odds of success and failure. The chance for a physical attacker to hit his/her opponent fluctuates during battle due to dex buffs/debuffs, eva buffs/debuffs, and techs.

Moving on from that, a 15% dex cut is significantly more detrimental to a physical attacker than a 15% mp cut would be to a mage. AGAIN. A mage can simply heal it back. A physical attacker needs to make up for it with techs and the like.

Also, if Haste gives you say +3 speed (as it does currently) and then cuts off 15% dex as you said, and ends up cutting 5, you are losing two points. Why even bother with Haste at all when you could have just traded 3 dex to your speed (especially since 30 dex is stupid high no matter what you're fighting)?

So if you want to argue that one dex is an omfgamechanger, be my guest. The point of all of this was that show that there is a happy median between the two. You just need to find it, and I will continue to argue until you do so.

One dex is not a game changer, just as 5 mp is not. 5 dex, however, IS a game changer, just as 25 mp is, as well. I can see and understand your arguments against the 50% mp cost of Haste, seeing as it is clearly not good enough to warrant such an exorbitant cost.

Time to go str and/or base mp. Stupid mp floors, amirite?

19 and 15 MP for a physical attacker. 75% leaves a mage sitting pretty at normal amounts (120 is still insane, I feel, as I would likely run 80-85 when I mage it out) (by sitting pretty I mean with more than 15 MP remaining after casting), and the spells are well worth the cost. The point of them being % spells was to allow them to be used by either side. I know you don't understand the value of MP on the physical side and how simply spending 5 MP is a big deal when it can only be done 5 times before you need to heal it back.

But joking aside, I never said that the mp loss is insignificant for a warrior. A 50% loss is too major for either class. That's why it needs to be lowered and balanced with a dex debuff. Possibly 25% for both. Or some other random number. I'm not the number guy.


Dex debuff will not be happening. It does nothing to balance anything. All it does is cause the whole system to vomit on itself. Especially since there is no way I'm going to waste time looking to find out how to institute a % stat cut for spell effects just to add in an incredibly pointless effect to a currently useful spell which will only serve to turn it completely useless.

That being said, the 50% will probably be dropping to somewhere more around 30-35%. Maybe lower than that. At 30%, it'd cost 23 MP with 75, or 36 with your 120, while costing 8 at 25.

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#140 Valor

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 12:04 PM

Need even more dex to go with your double turns? Try a Mockingjay enchanted with dodge break and use target.

I don't agree with this form of counter argument at all in any form. Why should I be forced to use any weapon type just to be able to hit enemies? I find that really stupid. Weapon choice should fall solely on what you like more in the combat role it was given. It shouldn't be dictated based on enemies. That's my opinion on the matter, anyway. If I want to use spears, I should be able to use spears against anything. There are enemies that can break that by having tons o evade and a weapon type can focus on Dex, like ranged, and that's fine. But to say I need to use a bow because I want to run haste is really the opposite of how I feel weapons should work.

And like Iggy said, no one runs 30 base Dex. No one. I set up my Dex stat to a place where I can hit an enemy comfortably with either Aqua or Aero (whichever I prefer). Basically...

You just don't understand efficiency.



Spoken like a true strength user. Lols.

Sacrificing my ability to hit consistently for damage for 3 points of speed is not worth it. I would never use the spell whatsoever.

Hey, I have an idea! Why don't we have a spell for mages that restores their MP but cuts their INT by 15%! That's no big deal, right? Right?


You seem to have an mp problem. Have you tried applying more than base mp? No? Okay, well, first try that.

Considering I focus the overwhelming majority of my points in any area to get double turns and deal damage efficiently, tossing away a point or two onto my MP is incredibly wasteful. That one point is oftentimes better spent in Speed, Dex, Strength, Health, or shoring up a defense.

Still having a problem? Consider one of the two following suggestions if your chapter two mp recovery tech just isn't cutting it when you're trying to cast haste, enchants, and healing spells:

1) Add three mag and cast one aspil. 20 net mp get!

2) Add zero mag and cast one aspira. 30 net mp get!

Protip: I use Aspi/l/ra. <_< I know how to manage 25 MP. You, however, can't seem to figure out how to manage 80. Who really needs the help here? >.>

But joking aside, I never said that the mp loss is insignificant for a warrior. A 50% loss is too major for either class.

Haste isn't worth 50% MP, and I never thought it was. Some other spells out there are totally worth a 50%+ MP Cost.

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