35 replies to this topic

[Sodomize-it Soro]

Truncated to basically include all non-heterosexual and all non-cisgender identities.


I think I'm the only non-heterosexual, non-cisgendered person here, but I wanted to make this thread for questions that people might have in the future.

For now, I found these images, and I think they're a pretty good place to start (sorry some of them are so large):

Spoiler

Also, I've transcribed the text on the images, as people have been having trouble reading it:

[spoiler=Five Things to Know About Your Queer Child]
1. If they haven't told you yet, they don't want you to know. Let them tell you.

2. Don't tell the rest of the family unless they tell you that you can.

3. It's not a phase, and it's not for attention.

4. It's not their responsibility to educate you on queerness. Do some research.

5. Be aware that young queer people are at a greater risk for mental and physical health problems, as well as substance abuse.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Five Thing to Know About Your Queer Friend]
1. If they haven't told you yet, they don't want you to know. Let them tell you.

2. Don't tell anybody unless they tell you that you can.

3. It's not a phase, and it's not for attention.

4. It's not their responsibility to educate you on queerness. Do some research.

5. Acknowledge that sexuality and gender is fluid, and if they're not queer in a few years, it wasn't a decision, it was just fluidity.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Five Ways to End Heterosexism*]
*Heterosexism is the hatred or discrimination of people who are not heterosexual.


1. When you meet somebody, don't assume that you know their sexual orientation.

2. Don't use gay as a synonym for stupid or bad.

3. Pay attention to how queer people are treated around the world, and speak up against mistreatment.

4. When people make homophobic comments, ask them to stop even if you aren't offended.

5. Don't act offended if people think you're queer.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Five Ways to End Cissexism*]
*Cissexism is the hatred or discrimination of people who are transgender.


1. When greeting people you don't know, avoid using words like "sir" or "ma'am" just in case you don't know somebody's gender identity.

2. Ask people what pronouns they prefer, and make sure you use them!

3. Don't use words like "tranny" or "shemale".

4. Don't assume that all women have vaginas and all men have penises.

5. Acknowledge that there are more than two genders![/spoiler]
[spoiler=Eight Queer Identities to Understand*]
*Despite fulfilling the definition of one of these identities, a person may not identify with the label. Make sure you check how they identify before making any assumptions.


Gay: refers to any male-identified person who is physically or emotionally attracted to other male-identified people.

Lesbian: refers to any female-identified person who is physically or emotionally attracted to other female-identified people.

Bisexual: refers to a person of any gender who is physically or emotionally attracted to people of the same and of other genders than themselves.

Transgender: refers to a person of any gender whose physical sex does not coincide with their real gender.

Two-Spirit: refers to an aboriginal person who fulfills multiple gender roles traditionally found in aboriginal culture.

Intersex: refers to a person whose biological sex cannot be classified as clearly a penis or a vagina.

Pansexual: refers to a person of any gender who is physically or emotionally attracted to people regardless of gender.

Asexual: refers to a person of any gender who lacks sexual attraction or an interest in sex.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Eight Trans Identities to Understand*]
*Despite fulfilling the definition of one of these identities, a person might not identify with the label. Make sure you check how they identify before making any assumptions. All of these identities are ways of describing people, not nouns.


FTM Transgender: refers to an individual who was identified as a female at birth and identifies as a male.

MTF Transgender: refers to an individual who was identified as a male at birth and identifies as a female.

Genderqueer: refers to any individual who identifies as a gender outside of the gender binary; can include agender, pangender, bigender, and third gender.

Agender: refers to an individual who identifies as having no gender.

Two-Spirit: refers to an aboriginal person who fulfills multiple gender roles traditionally found in aboriginal culture.

Bigender: refers to an individual who identifies as being a combination of both binary genders.

Pangender: refers to an individual who identifies as being a combination of all genders, including non-binary genders.

Third Gender: refers to an individual who identifies as a gender that is part of the ternary gender system.[/spoiler]




Members:

Soroxasaurus - Pansexual, Agender


If you'd like to join as a member, just say so and I'll add you to the list with your preferred sexual/gender identities. :>

Edited by Sodomize-it Soro, 24 October 2012 - 11:24 PM.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

I'm going to start a FAQ in this post, and I'll add more as I receive more questions.

Q: What does cisgendered mean?
A: Cisgendered is when one's sex matches their gender identity.

Q: What is the difference between pansexuality and bisexuality?
A: Pansexuality is an attraction to all genders and/or sexes. Bisexuality is an attraction to the male and females genders and/or sexes. However, someone who identifies as bisexual may, in fact, fulfill the definition of a pansexual, and either believes that the term identity of bisexuality includes the genders and sexes other than male and female, or is not aware of the identity of pansexuality.

Q: What does being agender entail/how can you be agender?
A: (Sorry, I sort of ramble on this one) It's sort of hard to explain, but I'll try through example to explain what it means for me. Suppose someone asks you to list some attributes of males and females. Most people would likely assign each group personality traits according to their society. I, on the other hand, would not be able to imagine anything beyond the physical attributes of men and women. Traits/behaviors are not intrinsically male/masculine or female/feminine to me, so I cannot assign them to a generalized image of men or women, and likewise men and women do not inherently adhere to trait/behavior generalizations. So, since I do not understand the social construct of gender, I do not identify with any one of them.

Q: I don't believe in bisexuality. How can someone like men and women equally?
A: When someone asks this, I usually liken it to a situation that more people can understand. Bisexuality is an emotional and/or sexual attraction to two (both) of the genders/sexes. So, let's say that it is analogous to being attracted to both redheads and brunet(te)s. Despite possibly showing favor to one or the other, the person will still be attracted to both. Also, despite being in a relationship with one or the other, the person will still be attracted to both. This does not mean that a bisexual will be "unfulfilled" in any monogamous relationship they're in. It just means that the base attraction will always be there. This does not always manifest in an attraction to someone outside of the relationship - while it certainly can, this has nothing to do with the nature of the person's attractions and everything to do with the specific people involved. As for any other sexuality, bisexuality is not a phase and it's not for attention. (All of this also goes for the other sexualities that aren't strictly hetero- or homosexual.)

Edited by Sodomize-it Soro, 06 November 2011 - 01:19 PM.

[Secret Igshar]

Out of curiosity, isn't it also possible that a bisexual acknowledges the presence of a gender spectrum but only finds him/herself attracted to those of the male and female sexes and/or genders? I mean, maybe said bisexual is attracted to "men" and "women" but not to anything in-between.

It feels weird, now, trying to come up with pronouns which have no gender. I refuse to use them/themself since "them" is a plural and the grammar nazi in me will not allow me to apply it to a singular object, except in the case of Hero in Space Theater.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

Hm, fair point. I did word that poorly. Thanks for the catch.

[Dion]

I can't really think of anywhere else to put this, but this is a question that I feel is relevant to the topic of homophobia.


How do people feel about marrying someone that has had a sex change? IE was a man, but is now a woman. Would you consider that wrong? Or would that be considered a gay marriage in your eyes?

On this topic, I'll be honest. I wouldn't marry someone like that. Call me homophobic but it just feels wrong to me... I mean the notion that my wife had a penis at one point in her life is just... o___o

[Kingroy]

Well that seems more like preference to me Dion.

[Secret Igshar]

I can't really think of anywhere else to put this, but this is a question that I feel is relevant to the topic of homophobia.


How do people feel about marrying someone that has had a sex change? IE was a man, but is now a woman. Would you consider that wrong? Or would that be considered a gay marriage in your eyes?

On this topic, I'll be honest. I wouldn't marry someone like that. Call me homophobic but it just feels wrong to me... I mean the notion that my wife had a penis at one point in her life is just... o___o

I would not consider it "gay marriage" since it would be a marriage between a man and a woman (assuming each partner identifies with the opposite, binary gender). I mean, when it comes down to it, it would depend on my physical and emotional attraction to the person. If I am not attracted enough, I would not feel comfortable settling down with them. Honestly, my biggest hangup would be the inability for said MTF Transsexual to give birth.

Also, if a transsexual identifies as being a homosexual, in that they identify (now) as a man/woman they would prefer relationships with the same gender/sex, then I suppose it would be gay marriage.

*goes off on a tangent*

Gay marriage, though, carries a rather large negative connotation in today's day and age, since it focuses almost entirely on homosexual males getting married. When we hear the term, we don't think about two women getting married or two people who identify with some other, non-binary gender and non-binary sexuality getting married. Marriage, when it boils down to it, is something done primarily (for most people) for legal reasons. It allows the two people to hold joint assets, to make critical decisions for one another in impossible situations, and affords the two certain rights which you cannot get elsewhere.

For this reason, I feel it is wrong to deny these rights to any pair of people who wish to have them. I mean the laws currently in place in most places are focused on the heterosexual, cisgendered community, and completely ignores anyone else because they are improper and not "right" in the eyes of whatever you feel like saying, be it your faith, your beliefs, your country's laws, etc, etc. Whichever argument you use, it's your OWN personal argument and it is wrong to then extrapolate that to everyone else.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

I can't really think of anywhere else to put this, but this is a question that I feel is relevant to the topic of homophobia.


How do people feel about marrying someone that has had a sex change? IE was a man, but is now a woman. Would you consider that wrong? Or would that be considered a gay marriage in your eyes?

On this topic, I'll be honest. I wouldn't marry someone like that. Call me homophobic but it just feels wrong to me... I mean the notion that my wife had a penis at one point in her life is just... o___o

Honestly, I can't even begin to understand the rationale - but then again, there are a lot of things about other people's sexuality that I could never understand.

But I don't think it's wrong to not be attracted to a post-op trans person. I mean, you can't really control not being attracted to that person.

Let me just ask a hypothetical, though. You're dating someone, you're deeply in love with them. They're perfect for you in every single way. When it gets to a serious level, they feel it's time to tell you that they're post-op trans. You would just stop loving them / being attracted to them altogether?

See, I just don't get that. And I realize that I'm pansexual, but really I just don't understand how a love so strong could just disappear like that because of something physical. I just... idek.

No offense meant to anyone, so I apologize if anyone took such to any of my statements.

[Shino]

Let me just ask a hypothetical, though. You're dating someone, you're deeply in love with them. They're perfect for you in every single way. When it gets to a serious level, they feel it's time to tell you that they're post-op trans. You would just stop loving them / being attracted to them altogether?

But that's like lying too and I don't like that. "Oh I'll wait until the last moment to let you know I used to be a man?" I'd be hella freaked out especially if the relationship was about to get up on a sexual level. It would really bother me knowing that I had sex with a used-to-be man.

[Dexel Hydagara]

It's called fear of rejection, Tangy Trash, and they got a pretty justified cause for it. Not everybody can take the heat of lots of people knowing what they are and probably disliking them for their choice. Some people can only trust one person or a very few, very close persons to know.

Is it aggrivating that they lied? Of course it is. Does that really change anything? ...I kinda fail to see where it does, granted that you love the individual in question. It's just pyschological borders, son. Nobody ( or at least nobody to my knowledge ) is really told they'll grow up to marry or fall in love with a trannsexual, but hey, it happens.

Well, that and you just having to acknowledge that you're not gonna know everything about someone from the get-go. Them not telling you until late on is a pretty good sign that they can finally trust you enough to tell ya.

TL;DR: People are afraid of what people will think of them sometimes. Some people have a hard time trusting anyone or telling something personal like that to someone else. They don't tell you late out of spite, they tell you that because you've earned their utmost trust ( among other things ).

Edited by Dexel, 15 November 2011 - 09:06 PM.

[Secret Igshar]

But that's like lying too and I don't like that. "Oh I'll wait until the last moment to let you know I used to be a man?" I'd be hella freaked out especially if the relationship was about to get up on a sexual level. It would really bother me knowing that I had sex with a used-to-be man.

See, I don't understand this. Going by Soro's hypothetical situation, you're in a loving, caring relationship with the girl and you love her. She comes out to you and tells you she's MTF Transsex and that suddenly turns you off of her forever since now you know that she once had a penis. I cannot understand that. I can't understand how you would possibly feel betrayed by the person, either.

If she tells you right off the bat, you'd blindly discriminate and say I DO NOT WANT ANYTHING TO DO WITH YOU but if she waits on it and realizes that she really loves you and you love her back and she reveals a very close, personal secret, you would discard her simply because she chose to hide something from you which allowed you to find something great? I don't even.

Them not telling you until late on is a pretty good sign that they can finally trust you enough to tell ya.

Pretty much this. It's not the kind of information someone would blurt out on the first date. It would scare most potential suitors away in an instant over unwarranted bias against transsexual people.

[Xanius]

I pretty much agree with Dexel. I've seen and known people that were terrified to tell people that they were MTF Transsex because of how people would react. If they said it right of the get go, many people looked at them with disgust and didn't even consider them a 'human' anymore. When they did wait and did fall deeply in love and were loved in return, they got beaten and trashed upon by the one that was suppose to love them no matter what. So what do they do? Come out on all first dates and always get rejected? Or wait and tell you later on when you might have fallen in love with her and look beyond what she said and love her for who she is, not what she is. =/

[Crimson Jazz]

While I definitely agree with what Dex said, I also partly agree with Shino. I would be kinda freaked out by the fact that she used to be a man, and there would be a glaring image in my head, imaging her as a man. However, if I was truly, deeply in love with her, I would learn to live with that knowledge and still be with her.

I wouldn't feel lied to, but I would be freaked out.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

But that's like lying too and I don't like that. "Oh I'll wait until the last moment to let you know I used to be a man?" I'd be hella freaked out especially if the relationship was about to get up on a sexual level. It would really bother me knowing that I had sex with a used-to-be man.

I didn't say at the last minute. I said when it starts getting serious (and "serious" here does not mean "sexual"). As Iggy said, that you're trans is not something you just randomly tell someone you barely know. It takes a lot of trust to be able to tell someone that, and it's sort of exacerbates the issue when you react as such.

I'm not saying it's not okay to not be attracted to a trans person, but that sort of reaction would not be okay.

Edited by Sodomize-it Soro, 15 November 2011 - 09:23 PM.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

A (Brief) Aide for Allies on Appropriateness

I know/understand how you feel.

No matter how much you know about the community and the problems it faces, as a non-member, you will never have the experience to truly know the oppression and marginalization members of the community face; that is your privilege. No one is saying you are a bad person for this, just that it's important for you to recognize this and empathize with the person rather than claiming identification with them.

Labels are for soup cans. / I only see people.

This initially sounds like a perfectly valid statement; the problem with it is that it seeks to ignore the power differences and experiences members of the community face. Labels are also useful for finding other people within the community to share these experiences with, to find a place of acceptance and support.

I'm an ally, I can't be homophobic!

No one is exempt from being able to exhibit homophobic behaviors. Being an ally is a constant process of learning and understanding.

Why are you being so mean to me?

When you say or do something problematic, expect someone to educate you on why exactly it was problematic. This is not an attack on you personally, and as per the previous section, you should take it as an opportunity to be a better ally. The person informing you should do so in a calm manner; however, if you take on a hostile attitude towards the person, expect them to likewise grow increasingly hostile.

Why don't you care about my opinions?

As an ally, your role is to provide support, and opinions in an open discussion. First, accept that sometimes people of the community will not want you to be in on a discussion or group; this is not because your opinions are invalid and that you are not appreciated, but that sometimes people want a place of safety free from outsiders and members of the group of oppressors, namely heterosexuals. Again, this is not a remark on you personally, but a way to ensure a place of support and comfort. Second, remain aware of how you speak on issues; learn from people within the community; support them because you know it's right, not because you expect appreciation or gratitude; be careful not to speak over or for people of the community, but with them or through what you have learned from them.

[Sodomize-it Soro]

I think it's problematic because people still currently use the term "fag" as a slur against non-heterosexuals. Language undeniably changes over time, but it's not so sudden that people can just claim a new meaning for a word, especially for such a socially charged one, and expect people to just be okay with it.

[Dion]

Thought this was the most relevant place to post this: http://www.addicting...-song-in-class/

In a country where there are states that have legalized gay marriage now, I find it unusual that things like this are still happening. I don't even think this is a big deal. It looks completely blown up for no reason and makes me frustrated. What do you guys think?

[Sodomize-it Soro]

To be blunt, this isn't that surprising. It's still horrible and stupid, but these kinds of things happen all the time all over the country.

[Dion]

I just feel it's unusual from a blue state, one that's been heavily blue for a while now. I understand that things like this still happen, but it doesn't make them any less disturbing.